Use of 'NORMA'L lifts in a fire?

[pdurkin]

Hi All,
In the HMG,FRA guides the statement is used:" Normal lifts may be considered suitable for fire evacuation purposes if they have fire protection" .Is there a definition of what extent this fire protection is? Does it come from a BS or building regulation? All passenger lifts even in relatively modern buildings have notices stating " In the event of a fire DO NOT USE THIS LIFT" Seems these notices are NORMAL as a get out (pun intended)
Regards,Paul

[SandersonFIRE]

Hi All,
In the HMG,FRA guides the statement is used:" Normal lifts may be considered suitable for fire evacuation purposes if they have fire protection" .Is there a definition of what extent this fire protection is? Does it come from a BS or building regulation? All passenger lifts even in relatively modern buildings have notices stating " In the event of a fire DO NOT USE THIS LIFT" Seems these notices are NORMAL as a get out (pun intended)
Regards,Paul

These are some of the standards governing lifts.
BS EN 81-1:1998
BS EN 115
CIBSE Design Guide D
BS 5656 Part2

David Charters gave a Paper on the subject at a BRE seminar entitled "The emergency use of lifts and escalators for evacuation"
There was an article in Mays FSE (Fire Safety Engineering) Magazine all about the emergency use of lifts.

I think a lot of the time it's best to steer clear of using lifts. Lots of variables and lots of possible problems. Only in places where fire safety is taken seriously should it be considered. As the article mentions there are probably times when it can be beneficial and preferential but certainly only under the right conditions.

Hope this helps

[Paul]

IIn generally standard passenger lifts are not considered in the evacuation procedures in buildings for the following reasons:

a) it is possible for intrapment due to loss of power
b) lifts could discharge occupants onto the floor containing the fire
c) extended evacuation time due to building occupant waiting for lift car to arrive

Lifts which are specifically designated for evacuation purpose can be used to evacuate building occupant safely and effectively, however it should be noted priority is to be given to people who might have difficulty with other escape routes.

A lift to be used for the evacuation of disabled people should be either an evacuation lift or a fire-fighting lift and should be operated under the direction and control of a competent (trained) person (normally your lift maintainer will provide this training). All evacuation lifts must be constructed in accordance with Building Regs (Part B)

The guidance in varrious HM Government guides and BS's allow In some circumstances a lift not designed for evacuation maybe considered for use during an evacuation however you will have to prove its suitability by means of a suitable and sufficient fire risk assessment ensuring the lift meets the functional asspects of a evacuation lift.

I hope this help.

Paul T

[Article 4]

The answer to the question will be found within BS5588 Part 8. This has recently been amended to BS9999. One area of concern that has not been stated previously by other contributors is that if the lift continues to operate during a fire situation, the bellows effect created by the lift carriage may further contribute to the rapid escalation of the fire where the lift is in the immediate vicinity. Always remember it only takes a 1% concentration of Carbon Monoxide (Co) for around 2 minutes exposure to kill you. Add to that, the immediate effect of Hydrogen Cyanide gas and Phosgene gas. These are given off as a result of combustion involving plastics and other Hydro Carbon based materials. The lift may not arrive adjacent to a final exit door, so having to pass through the building to make your escape would indeed expose the individual to all manner of hot gases, super- heated air and of course fire. Where possible, only fire protected escape routes should be used to guarantee safe escape. These routes are governed by fire reg's and exclude combustible materials, storage and sources of ignition. Fire and smoke protection are afforded the escapee by the design and construction of the building. Fire doors with a minimum of 30 minutes fire resistance feature on each level of stairway. The stairway will lead directly to a final exit door. Ahhh fresh air!!

[ShaneHogan]

For many people with disabilities, use of a lift is the only option for vertical movement during evacuation that offers independence, dignity and safety. While evacuation chairs can be useful for some people, they can be very difficult for others, particularly those that are unable to transfer out of their own chair.

Ideally, evacuation or fire-fighting lifts would be available, but unfortunately, this is rarely the case. Decisions about use of 'normal' lifts should be made on a risk-assessment basis. There are risks involved with using such lifts, just as there are risks involved with the other options for vertical movement.